Sonic Youth Gossip

Sonic Youth Gossip (http://www.sonicyouth.com/gossip/index.php)
-   Non-Sonics (http://www.sonicyouth.com/gossip/forumdisplay.php?f=5)
-   -   The Politics Thread (http://www.sonicyouth.com/gossip/showthread.php?t=123593)

The Soup Nazi 02.09.2021 09:18 PM

 

!@#$%! 02.09.2021 09:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Soup Nazi
 

they got the elephants backwards because the real republican party has no head and is talking out of their asshole(s)

The Soup Nazi 02.09.2021 10:59 PM

Paul Krugman's NYT newsletter, February 9:


Quote:

The covert unifier that America needed

In his inaugural speech, President Joe Biden talked a lot about “unity” — which made many progressives, myself included, very nervous. Would he do what President Obama did, scaling down his economic plans and wasting time in a vain effort to win bipartisan support?

It turns out that we needn’t have worried. As I wrote in today’s column, Democrats appear to have learned some lessons from the Obama years, and Biden’s Congressional allies are moving fast on what seems likely to be a big economic relief package — one that seems almost certain to pass the Senate, barely, on a straight party-line vote.

Inevitably, some in the media are chiding Biden for, as they see it, going back on his promise to seek unity. But anyone who paid attention in 2009 knows that there was never a chance of getting support for economic relief, or for that matter almost anything else, from Republicans in Congress. If Biden had tried to move their way, they would simply have moved the goal posts, keeping compromise forever out of reach.

Yet there is a sense in which Biden actually is delivering on unity. He isn’t giving any ground to Republican politicians; but his main proposals for Covid-19 relief draw broad support from ordinary voters, including many self-identified Republicans. So he isn’t winning over any G.O.P. apparatchiks, because that’s an impossible task, but he’s unifying most of the country behind his agenda all the same. That is, he’s a stealth unifier, with his cross-party appeal flying under the radar of pundits focused only on what politicians and activists say.

In fact, public support for Biden’s agenda is so strong that it poses some puzzles. For Biden’s economic plans have much broader support than Obama’s did at this stage of his presidency. Why? And why won’t any Republican politicians go along with plans this popular?

Here’s a chart I find eye-popping. It compares the public’s views on the Obama stimulus in 2009, as reported in a CNN poll, with recent views on Biden’s relief package, as estimated by Quinnipiac:

 


In case you’re wondering, that 2009 poll was taken while Obama was still in his honeymoon period, with personal favorables substantially higher than Biden’s now (although Biden fares decently, certainly compared with his predecessor). So this reflects popular judgments on the policies, not the men. What’s going on?

Well, I have a theory. I’ve spent pretty much the whole pandemic shouting, to mainly deaf ears, that economic relief isn’t “stimulus.” My guess is that despite the best efforts of many in the news media to conflate the two, most voters get that; they see Biden’s American Rescue Plan as, well, a rescue plan, not an attempt to pump up demand.

Not that there’s anything wrong with pumping up demand, which was in fact exactly what the nation needed (and didn’t get enough of) in 2009. But Keynesian economics, which underlies the case for stimulus in a depressed economy, is hard. Many people — including some professional economists — just can’t wrap their minds around the idea that deficit spending can create jobs and make the nation richer. Even F.D.R. tried to balance the budget in 1937, with disastrous results.

On the other hand, the idea of helping people when disaster strikes is intuitive, and at least for now most Americans are feeling generous.

Republican politicians, of course, don’t share that feeling. And they don’t see any need to pretend otherwise. They’re much more afraid of the party’s base, which doesn’t even accept Biden’s legitimacy, than they are of being seen obstructing aid to Americans in need.

But that more or less by definition means that they can’t be won over, no matter what Biden does. The reality of where we are politically, hidden in plain sight, is that on policy Biden actually has unified a surprisingly large majority of Americans.

Quick Hits

Even Republicans used to support those $2000 checks.

But the Republican base hates compromise.

After all, their leaders blame Nancy Pelosi for the attack on the Capitol. Really.

Conservative think tanks hate the idea of helping children.

!@#$%! 02.10.2021 08:59 PM

iran has begun to produce uranium metal. great job, stable genius! a fine legacy... :rolleyes:

The Soup Nazi 02.10.2021 09:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by !@#$%!
iran has begun to produce uranium metal. great job, stable genius! a fine legacy... :rolleyes:


Javad Zarif said just days ago that Teheran is ready to come back to the JCPOA if the United States does, but it's "the deal you made, or nothing". And regardless of how one feels about Iran, who can blame 'em?

The Soup Nazi 02.10.2021 09:14 PM

From Fareed Zakaria's newsletter:


Quote:

America’s Political Unreality

As the US Senate proceeds with former President Donald Trump’s second impeachment trial, two recent New York Times columns by Thomas B. Edsall make clear that America’s problems run deeper than any Senate-chamber drama.

A CNN poll from January, conducted by SSRS, found that 58% of Republicans surveyed believed there was solid evidence that President Biden didn’t legitimately secure enough votes in November to defeat Trump and win the presidency, and in a column published Wednesday, Edsall cites more polls and other research as indicative of a troubling—and troublingly partisan—rift. “Asked if Trump has acted ‘responsibly’ or ‘irresponsibly’ since the Nov. 3 election,” Edsall writes of a mid-January Washington Post/ABC News survey, “the 1002 adults polled chose ‘irresponsibly’ by 66-30. Republicans, in contrast, chose ‘responsibly’ by 66-29.”

Conspiracy-theory thinking has flourished, Edsall wrote in a column last week exploring the drivers of QAnon and painting a choleric portrait of the contemporary right: “The problem of keeping the extremist fringe at arm’s length has plagued the Republican Party for decades—dating back to Joseph McCarthy and the John Birch Society—but nothing in recent American history has reached the crazed intensity of Donald Trump’s perseverating, mendacious insistence that he won a second term in November. That he is not alone—that millions continue to believe in his delusions—is terrifying.”

As Edsall notes, Harvard scholar Daniel Ziblatt told Vox last month that he believes the GOP “now looks like a European far-right party. But the big difference … is that the US only has two parties and one of them is like a European far-right party.” To Edsall, that raises disturbing questions about the country’s political future.

Skuj 02.13.2021 02:01 PM

https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/...o-acquit-trump

I had allowed myself to think that Jan 6th to Moscow Mitch was akin to Christmas Morning for Ebenezer Scrooge. Silly me.

Skuj 02.13.2021 03:36 PM

I predict that 3 GOP will have the balls to vote for conviction.

Skuj 02.13.2021 03:53 PM

Wow. 7!!!

The Soup Nazi 02.13.2021 04:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skuj
Wow. 7!!!


So 43 motherfuckers.

I know:

 


"I peg you as a 'glass is half empty' kinda guy, am I right?"

Skuj 02.13.2021 05:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skuj
https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/...o-acquit-trump

I had allowed myself to think that Jan 6th to Moscow Mitch was akin to Christmas Morning for Ebenezer Scrooge. Silly me.


McConnell drives me insane. He basically agrees with the Dems, but votes to acquit on some silliness.

The Soup Nazi 02.13.2021 05:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skuj
McConnell drives me insane. He basically agrees with the Dems, but votes to acquit on some silliness.


So silly (BULLSHITTY, in fact) that he himself doesn't believe it. His seat may not be at stake (polls showed Kentucky was 50/50 on convicting Seditious Fatfuck), but with over 80% of "your" senators voting to acquit, you start thinking about the future of your position as Leader.

Motherfuckers, all of 'em.

The Soup Nazi 02.13.2021 10:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Soup Nazi
So silly (BULLSHITTY, in fact) that he himself doesn't believe it.



Summarized by a New York Times reader:

Quote:

For Mitch McConnell to publicly profess Donald Trump’s guilt, while hiding behind his claim of the unconstitutionality of the impeachment trial, is hypocrisy par excellence from the master of hypocrisy. Mr. McConnell himself refused to call back the Senate to receive the article of impeachment while Mr. Trump was in office, thereby creating the very impediment to conviction he cites.

Given that the House voted to impeach on Jan. 13, and this trial took five days, there would have been time for the trial to reach its conclusion before the change of administration on Jan. 20.

The Soup Nazi 02.13.2021 10:51 PM

The real question is, why does it have to be these fucking assholes. The GOP can lift a rock and find any number of mooks who want government to be minimized and abortion to be banned. But no; in addition, they just have to be the Lindsey Grahams and Marco Rubios and Ted Cruces * of this world - wretched walking vomits who shamelessly pull the most disgusting 180ºs I've seen in my life. And the obvious kicker: THEY KEEP GETTING REELECTED. HOW FUCKING STUPID IS THEIR FUCKING ELECTORATE. Fine, believe the Reagan bullshit that has fucked the United States up for forty years, but take a goddamn minute and ponder this for a change.

Too much to ask? It is, I know. And it happens everywhere - the fact that it's the U.S. amplifies it, but in my own country... eh, I'll leave that boring crap for another post.

(* In Spanish, the plural of "cruz" is "cruces", so don't give me shit over my spelling. ;))

h8kurdt 02.14.2021 11:18 AM

Nice to not have Bytor and co adamantly saying Trump was innocent of all wrongdoing. Not sure I could deal with that atm. Thing I hate the most is the total corruption by the CUNTS.

The Soup Nazi 02.14.2021 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by h8kurdt
Nice to not have Bytor and co adamantly saying Trump was innocent of all wrongdoing. Not sure I could deal with that atm.


I was thinking the same last night.

!@#$%! 02.14.2021 11:47 AM

yup

Skuj 02.15.2021 07:15 PM

I'm watching what is happening to those in the GOP who criticize Trump, and.....

https://blog.usejournal.com/10-signs...t-1921eb5a3857

On another note, the announcement of a 9/11 style independent commission into Jan 6th is welcome news.

The Soup Nazi 02.15.2021 07:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skuj
I'm watching what is happening to those in the GOP who criticize Trump, and.....

https://blog.usejournal.com/10-signs...t-1921eb5a3857


10 out of 10.

The Soup Nazi 02.15.2021 07:25 PM

You gotta be fucking kidding me:

House Republicans demand answers from Pelosi on security decisions leading up to Capitol riot

Republicans say there are 'many important questions' about Pelosi's 'responsibility for the security'


Yeah, I'm sure she diminished the security in order to commit suicide-by-QAnon. Pieces of shit, these FUCKS.

Skuj 02.15.2021 07:45 PM

Whataboutism on an epic scale.

Skuj 02.15.2021 07:50 PM

I cannot help feeling that in any other time in USA history, the vast majority of the population would look at what Trump/GOP has done/tweeted/said over the last 4+ years, and shake their head in disgust.

But in 2020/1, the GOP thrives.

How did it come to this?

Skuj 02.15.2021 07:53 PM

(Dude, you linked to Fox for that headline. Everything is explained.)

!@#$%! 02.15.2021 08:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skuj
How did it come to this?

the short version is that trump offered a false solution to the problem of economic dislocation caused by trade, and the discontents of globalization bought his scam.

the solution obviously is domestic policy, not trade policy, but the repukes will have none of that, and have been undermining the middle class since the 80s.

so there is more money to go around, but it mostly goes to billionaires, and instead of taxing the billionaires mexico gets the blame. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

one positive thing you can say about biden is he understands first-hand the pain of unemployment and economic dislocation so i expect he'll do something to address this. "buy american" isn't exactly the answer, but it has ok symbolism without demonizing other nations. still, economically, it's a bad move. what's needed is domestic policy: money from free trade redistributed to domestic programs, free education, affordable healthcare, income support without the huge bureaucracy, etc.

what's the point of being a rich country if your citizens are poor?

The Soup Nazi 02.16.2021 08:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by !@#$%!
what's the point of being a rich country if your citizens are poor?


The point is being SUPER-ULTRA-MEGA-RICH! If you're in the top 1%, that is. On a smaller scale, it's the same here, where Reaganomics started even before Reagan was elected in the U.S. of A.

!@#$%! 02.16.2021 08:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Soup Nazi
The point is being SUPER-ULTRA-MEGA-RICH! If you're in the top 1%, that is. On a smaller scale, it's the same here, where Reaganomics started even before Reagan was elected in the U.S. of A.

yeah, you were the laboratory for the chicago boys.

and it worked, in a way, but in another, still doesn't

The Soup Nazi 02.18.2021 05:54 PM

Fact-checked and all:

Did Ted Cruz Fly to Cancun During Texas Energy Crisis?

Spoiler alert: YES HE DID THE FUCKIN' WEASEL.

More: https://news.google.com/stories/CAAq...S&ceid=US%3Aen

choc e-Claire 02.18.2021 06:07 PM

Where's the $2,000?

_tunic_ 02.19.2021 03:59 AM

I wonder if he really intended it to be a one day holiday? Reminds me of this story from last October: Covid: Dutch king expresses regret over Greek holiday scandal

The difference is that our King only has ceremonial duties, Cruz is actually responsible!

h8kurdt 02.19.2021 04:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by _tunic_
I wonder if he really intended it to be a one day holiday? Reminds me of this story from last October: Covid: Dutch king expresses regret over Greek holiday scandal

The difference is that our King only has ceremonial duties, Cruz is actually responsible!


Seeing conservative knuckle draggers defending him is too funny. Boot lickers the lot of them. Cruz is also showing his strength of character by blaming his kids on the trip. First he allows Trump to shit on (not literally as far as I know) his wife, then he's blaming his kids for deciding to take a trip in the middle of a)a pandemic and b)a snowstorm that has left seemingly half the state crippled.

AND! people keep voting for him. Mental.

The Soup Nazi 02.19.2021 10:58 PM

Zakaria's latest Washington Post column:


Quote:

GOP Probably Won’t Rein In Its Fringe

The central question in American politics right now — one with global implications — is whether the Republican Party can purge itself of its most extreme elements. Obviously this relates to former president Donald Trump, but it goes beyond him as well. The current Republican congressional delegation includes people who insist the 2020 election was stolen, have ties to violent extremist groups, traffic in antisemitism and have propagated QAnon ideologies in the past. At the state level, it often gets worse. Mainstream Republicans have tolerated these voices and views for years. Can the party finally find a way to control them?

The answer to this question could well determine the future of American democracy. In a brilliant scholarly work, “Conservative Parties and the Birth of Democracy,” Harvard’s Daniel Ziblatt revealed the key to why, in the early 20th century, Britain stayed a democracy and Germany veered into fascism: The conservative party in the United Kingdom was able to discipline its extremists. For years before World War I, British conservatives faced a threat from anti-democratic elements of their party, particularly radicals in Northern Ireland. The Tory Party, strong and hierarchical, was eventually able to tamp down these factions and stabilize British democracy.

In Germany, by contrast, the main conservative party, the DNVP, was weak and disorganized, dependent on outside groups for help. This provided an opening for the nationalist Alfred Hugenberg, an early incarnation of Rupert Murdoch, who used his media empire and business connections to seize control of the party and try to drive it to the right. The infighting sapped the strength of the party, and many of its voters began to flock to far-right alternatives such as the Nazi Party. Hugenberg allied with Hitler, thinking that this would be a way to decidedly take control of the conservative movement. The rest is history.

I am not making a comparison between extreme Republicans and the Nazis. I am making the argument that when parties lose the ability to police their extremists, bad things happen not just to the party but also to democracy. Already, much of today’s Republican Party has been permeated by extremism. According to a recent American Enterprise Institute survey, 56 percent of Republicans believe “the traditional American way of life is disappearing so fast that we may have to use force to save it.” Thirty-nine percent backed an even stronger statement: “If elected leaders will not protect America, the people must do it themselves even if it requires taking violent actions.” These are not views compatible with democracy.

The Republican Party has lost control of the forces it has long encouraged. An early moment of reckoning took place in the 1980s, according to David Frum’s prescient book “Dead Right.” As conservatives saw it, they had finally taken charge for the first time since FDR’s reign in the 1930s. Now they could repeal the New Deal and the Great Society. As they quickly realized, however, the public was utterly opposed to doing so. Ever since then, Republicans have gotten comfortable lying to their voters.

Over time, the party was taken over by the increasingly frustrated mob. Consider the difference between the government shutdowns of the mid-1990s and of 2013. The former were centrally planned and directed by the House Republican leader, Newt Gingrich (Ga.). The latter was demanded by the tea party, and though House Speaker John A. Boehner (R-Ohio) acquiesced, he was eventually pushed out of office by those same radicals.

In 2016, the Republican Party could not come together to defeat and purge Trump. The party hierarchy had lost its clout. Besides, other presidential hopefuls such as Sens. Ted Cruz (Tex.) and Marco Rubio (Fla.) wanted to court Trump’s base, not alienate it. A few leaders, such as Mitt Romney, condemned Trump, but it was all too little, too late.

U.S. political parties have become dangerously weak. Once, they picked the presidential candidates to present to the public. Now, primary voters — often more radical than party leaders — have usurped that key function. Once, the parties firmly controlled campaign funds. Today, thanks to various Supreme Court rulings, outside groups have much more cash and influence than they used to.

So the odds are against the Republican Party disciplining its most radical elements. Some hope that electoral losses might force those actions. But remember that while 2020 was a bad year for Trump, it wasn’t such a bad year for other Republicans. The party narrowly lost control of Congress, but it did well in state houses across the country, sometimes with the help of voter suppression and gerrymandering.

Europe’s parties have not been captured by radical forces because they have stronger internal structures, but they are also weakening. Everywhere, the media has splintered and been decentralized, making it harder to purge extreme voices. We are moving into a world where democracies have fewer and fewer gatekeepers. Without realizing it, we are embarked on a new and dangerous experiment in governance.

Skuj 02.20.2021 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by h8kurdt
Seeing conservative knuckle draggers defending him is too funny. Boot lickers the lot of them. Cruz is also showing his strength of character by blaming his kids on the trip. First he allows Trump to shit on (not literally as far as I know) his wife, then he's blaming his kids for deciding to take a trip in the middle of a)a pandemic and b)a snowstorm that has left seemingly half the state crippled.

AND! people keep voting for him. Mental.


Is there a bigger clown in politics than Cruz? I hope this sticks. Plus, you know, that election rejection thing.

The Soup Nazi 02.20.2021 11:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skuj
Is there a bigger clown in politics than Cruz? I hope this sticks. Plus, you know, that election rejection thing.


Asshole left the dog behind to freeze in his fucking mansion. That's even worse than supporting Trump.

The Soup Nazi 02.20.2021 11:52 PM

 


 


 


 

Skuj 02.21.2021 04:42 PM

This almost begs the question: WTF do Senators do?

_tunic_ 02.21.2021 04:56 PM

Golf

choc e-Claire 02.21.2021 05:37 PM

Not give people $2,000.

Skuj 02.21.2021 05:45 PM

Oh please. Oh please.

https://thehill.com/homenews/politic...ump-party-poll

tw2113 02.21.2021 05:56 PM

So almost half of the current GOP voter base love to fellate Trump. It'll be interesting to see if anything actually comes from this, given how many other parties have tried to become relevant.

Skuj 02.21.2021 07:22 PM

It's good news for so many reasons:

Please, GOP, split up!!

But, only half? I thought The Orange Blob commanded epic loyalty. The Bytemes and Skunks of this world are actually thinking clearly now?


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:11 PM.

Powered by vBulletin Version 3.5.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
All content ©2006 Sonic Youth